We’re all familiar with Sesame Street, and the wonderful cast of Muppets teaching us about life and love. We’re less familiar with the people behind the scenes. I don’t mean the puppeteers—I mean the writers who gave the puppeteers something to do. Mark Saltzman wrote for Sesame Street for 15 years. He also dated and lived with a famous editor Arnold Glassman. Saltzman’s heyday on the show was in the 80s and 90s, when being gay was not something you could talk very openly about.
In a new interview with LGBTQ-focused publication Queerty, Saltman admitted something that a lot of people have always suspected: Bert and Ernie are not roommates. They’re gay. Interviewer David Reddish asked if that’s how the writers thought of the two muppets and this was his response:
I remember one time that a column from The San Francisco Chronicle, a preschooler in the city turned to mom and asked “are Bert & Ernie lovers?” And that, coming from a preschooler was fun. And that got passed around, and everyone had their chuckle and went back to it. And I always felt that without a huge agenda, when I was writing Bert & Ernie, they were. I didn’t have any other way to contextualize them. The other thing was, more than one person referred to Arnie & I as “Bert & Ernie.”
He added that he thinks of himself as an “Ernie” while Arnie was more of a “Bert.” It was easy to channel their own dynamic at home into the characters.
“So I don’t think I’d know how else to write them, but as a loving couple,” he added. None of this is new. It’s been hinted at forever. In fact, when gay marriage was legalized in 2013, Bert and Ernie were featured on the cover of The New Yorker:
A cover from 2013: Bert and Ernie’s “Moment of Joy.” https://t.co/iVmV1JyDxa pic.twitter.com/licDoenyaV
— The New Yorker (@NewYorker) September 18, 2018
The Internet is feeling extremely vindicated:
Since it is now known that Ernie and Bert are in fact a gay couple, I give Bert way more credit for putting up with all Ernie’s bullshit.
— Anonymous White House Official (@dvorakoelling) September 18, 2018
| ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄|
| LET BERT AND |
| ERNIE BE THE |
| GAY ICONS WE |
| DESERVE! |
|___________|
(\_____/) ||
(????ㅅ????) ||
/ づ— Blair Imani (@BlairImani) September 18, 2018
If Bert and Ernie mad fuckin' then that is none of our business
— Fred Delicious (@Fred_Delicious) September 18, 2018
But there’s a snafu. Sesame Workshop has come out with an official statement saying that Bert and Ernie are not gay. They’re puppets. They have no sexual orientation:
Please see our statement below regarding Bert and Ernie. pic.twitter.com/6r2j0XrKYu
— Sesame Workshop (@SesameWorkshop) September 18, 2018
And Frank Oz, master puppeteer and director of the Muppets, also contested the idea that the guys are gay. He also said it doesn’t matter, but they’re still not gay.
It seems Mr. Mark Saltzman was asked if Bert & Ernie are gay. It's fine that he feels they are. They're not, of course. But why that question? Does it really matter? Why the need to define people as only gay? There's much more to a human being than just straightness or gayness.
— Frank Oz (@TheFrankOzJam) September 18, 2018
I created Bert. I know what and who he is.
— Frank Oz (@TheFrankOzJam) September 18, 2018
Oz is arguing with people in the comments about why Bert and Ernie aren’t gay, and he does admit that queer representation is important:
Agreed. When a character is created to be queer it is indeed important that the character be known as such. It is also important when a character who was not created queer, be accepted as such.
— Frank Oz (@TheFrankOzJam) September 18, 2018
But a lot of people are pointing out that plenty of Muppets go through serious stuff regarding romance and sexuality, so it doesn’t make sense that being queer is outside the realm of possibility:
are you kidding me, you’re gonna sit here and tell me Bert and Ernie aren’t gay because puppets don’t fuck after I had to go through Kermit and Miss Piggy’s fucking divorce????????
— angel viago-iglar (@angelnorelation) September 18, 2018
to those saying "Bert and Ernie are in Sesame Street and Kermit and Ms. Piggy are in The Muppets so its a different situation"
SNUFFY'S STR8 PARENTS GOT A DIVORCE pic.twitter.com/kAYV79QgNn
— ????Julie Moonvest???? (@FirstKnivesClub) September 18, 2018
Maybe Frank Oz is Bert and Ernie’s creator, but they’ve both grown to be important to way more people in a completely different way. Sometimes dads just need to read the signs.